Posted: 29 May 2012, 11:24 Post subject: Re: 28/05/2012 - The Krall Castle by Andrew "Sinistral" Allison
Skaarj Elder
Joined: Mar 15th, 2009 Posts: 1406 Location: England
I had a go at Forgotten but got stuck on this level. Could not figure out where to go after a certain point. I'll wait for the video to see where I went wrong.
Posted: 29 May 2012, 17:52 Post subject: Re: 28/05/2012 - The Krall Castle by Andrew "Sinistral" Allison
Skaarj Berserker
Joined: Apr 11th, 2009 Posts: 462 Location: ಠ_ಠ
I didn't like the start of this map, but the rest easily makes up for it. Forgotten's outdoor areas are always great, and this map is no exception. The castle was pretty impressive, too.
Posted: 29 May 2012, 18:09 Post subject: Re: 28/05/2012 - The Krall Castle by Andrew "Sinistral" Allison
Skaarj Scout
Joined: Nov 25th, 2011 Posts: 40
This is the level in Forgotten where I got stuck a couple of times, too, and ended up just using the switchcooplevel command to load the next level at a certain point. (If you've never seen the rest of the pack, it's definitely worth playing through - one of my favorite map packs.)
But eventually I figured out what I was supposed to have done to finish the level (see below).
Spoiler:
It's a pretty epic level with several areas to it - starting with a prison area where rows of cells face each other across long corridors where rain falls on you through the open ceilings (a cool Unreal 227 effect), and after a few other areas one comes to the big Krall Castle itself, which takes some time to complete. After finishing the sub-mission in the Krall Castle, one gains access to a Nali Sanctuary, where one is rewarded for defeating some of the Krall foes, and there' a moment where one interacts with a levitating Nali who seems to indicate that he will help you to leave this place. And it seems like the level should be ending there, but no level load happens and that's where I got stuck a few times. However, if one is paying attention earlier on, one will notice a room in a connecting section of corridors right after the prison area, where there is a transparent forcefield that divides the room in two, with a button on either side of the forcefield, and the translator message tells you that it takes two people pressing the buttons simultaneously from either side of the forcefield to deactivate it. So the somewhat counterintuitive thing that you have to remember to do later on, after talking to the Nali shaman in the Keep, is to backtrack all the way through most of the level to this room near the beginning, where this time you will be met with some assistance in finally bypassing the forcefield, leading to the level exit and the loading of the next map in the series.
This map (the 4th out of 7 in the pack) is probably the one that takes the longest to complete, and that final "backtrack journey" is probably the one thing in the whole pack that I found to be a little contrived or not entirely logical and intuitive to figure out (everything else in the series flows quite smoothly). So it can be frustrating to get stuck there and end up wandering around the Krall Castle again and the Nali Keep, without necessarily stumbling across the idea of retracing one's steps to an even earlier section of the level, but if you avoid that particular pitfall then the experience of the map is actually quite satisfying and it ends up being one of the more memorable maps in the pack.
The maps in Unreal: Forgotten display a lot of great variety and overall it is one of the packs that I enjoy replaying (along with the greats like Deja Vu, Project Zephon, Skaarj Tower: Shadow and Fire, ONP, Xidia Gold, Seven Bullets, Shamuquest, Tower of Shrak'itha, et al). My sense is that Forgotten has probably been experienced by a smaller number of players than some of those other packs, because it requires Unreal 227f (or later) and doesn't work in OldSkool/UT, but it's definitely worth checking out, and the pack remains the chief reason at this point for my keeping both Unreal 227h and UT99 GOTY installed on my PC... So congrats to Sinistral for creating a memorable map, and pack, and I hope this posting will encourage a few other players to revisit the pack, if they got stuck near the end of this map, and will encourage others who may not have tried it at all to check it out!
Posted: 29 May 2012, 18:36 Post subject: Re: 28/05/2012 - The Krall Castle by Andrew "Sinistral" Allison
Nali Priest
Joined: Nov 11th, 2007 Posts: 5948
I played Forgotten and was not very happy about it. Hell I don't remember much of the pack. It's on the same level of Xenome.
The first area of this map had a bug in which the Nali wouldn't open the door for you. Happened one time. The castle was extremely confusing, the rooms looked way too similar from each other. Finding the way to the exit was also extremely troublesome. It took the entire afternoon to finish this level.
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Posted: 30 May 2012, 00:37 Post subject: Re: 28/05/2012 - The Krall Castle by Andrew "Sinistral" Allison
Skaarj Assassin
Joined: Oct 27th, 2009 Posts: 104 Location: Glasgow, Scotland
Hi guys thanks for the comments. Personally I think this is the best map of the pack, it defiantly took the most time to get right. Although it's not "in your face" obvious that a degree of backtracking is required in this map there really isn't all that much, there are translator messages scattered throughout the level which point you in the right direction. All you essentially have to do is kill the Krall "boss" Lord Hichka , then head for sanctuary where a kind Nali will help you get through the barrier, you can also take a short-cut under the water well in the village. IMO the barrier is kind of hard to forget. If you keep walking straight at the start of the level it's something you can't help but come up against, the two computers, the barrier and the cryptic message about requiring two people to operate the console should ear-mark this as place you will want find your way into.
I understand the comments about the rooms in the castle looking similar, and have tried to address these in the unreal_forgotten_final release, but the layout inside there is actually pretty linear. You can either go up or down. I don't know if anyone spotted the surprise skaarj attack as the Skaarj drop-ships arrive once you've battled the Lord Hichka, I tried to add some more events like this into the level because of the sheer size and very open area it can be difficult to keep up the gameplay pace. There are also other drop-ships if you back-track further to the Nali village, the issue is that quite these kind of events can be very easy to miss, as the player is focused on just running though level in the shortest possible time. I tried to use music changes to draw the player attention, but it doesn't always work. As it happens, I do have a video play though of this level, but it doesn’t show all the best aspects, just how to get though it quickly, even then it’s 25 minutes long and a rather large file to upload. I will try and convert it but someone else might be able to do it quicker.
Posted: 01 Jun 2012, 01:25 Post subject: Re: 28/05/2012 - The Krall Castle by Andrew "Sinistral" Allison
Trustee Member
Joined: Nov 12th, 2007 Posts: 1306 Location: UK
How big is the video? It has been removed because your account doesn't support longer videos, but if you could get it to me I can upload it to my account (that does).
Posted: 03 Jun 2012, 03:25 Post subject: Re: 28/05/2012 - "The Krall Castle" by Andrew "Sinistral" Allison
Trustee Member
Joined: Nov 12th, 2007 Posts: 1306 Location: UK
This is probably the biggest level in Forgotten and maybe the best despite a few issues I have with it. I like the open-air design of the starting prison; it feels like an original twist on a standard theme. I like the twisty design of the bridge that takes you over the large chasm too, along with being able to look down on it from the village. I think the Krall castle interior is a little too simple though; even with the additions in the updated version it's structure and gameplay seems a bit repetitive, something about the somewhat gloomy library in the basement sticks out to me atmospherically though. The way to the exit definitely can be quite easy to miss but it's not like it's intentionally hidden or something. It's mostly enjoyable to go through though outside of the semi-major backtracking (at least the new events along the way help with that).
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